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Thread: Sayfullo Habibullaevic Saipov Sentenced to LWOP in 2017 NY Murders of Eight

  1. #81
    Senior Member CnCP Legend Mastro Titta's Avatar
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    Frankly, I don't get your certainty that "he will never be executed". Democrats won't have the presidency forever. It's this kind of defeatism that is making progressives winning the culture war.

  2. #82
    Administrator Aaron's Avatar
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    It would take 20+ years for the sentence to be carried out, assuming Biden doesn't empty death row before leaving office. It's nothing more than a fantasy to think capital punishment will exist in 20 years at this rate. The SCOTUS majority will age and die, and as soon as Democrats get a majority on SCOTUS it will be ruled unconstitutional. I'm sorry but no Republican is going to win at this point again. Republicans barely took back the House on the heels of the utter failure of this administration. As future generations become less White, more diverse, more LGBTQ+++, more economically disenfranchised, etc the Republican share of the vote will only continue to diminish.
    Don't ask questions, just consume product and then get excited for next products.

    "They will hurt you. They will hurt your grandma, these people. The root cause of this is there's no discipline in the homes, they don't go to school, you know, they live off the government, no personal accountability, and they just beat people up for no reason, and it's disgusting." - Former Hamilton County Prosecutor Joe Deters

  3. #83
    Senior Member CnCP Legend Mastro Titta's Avatar
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    I would agree, if I wouldn't ever heard the same defeatism over Roe v. Wade over and over again, only to have it overruled after I don't even remember how many decades. I know the current statistics, and I'm equally worried about them, but history is something too complex to be able to put everything down all-black or all-white, not mentioning the role of unpredictable players.

  4. #84
    Administrator Aaron's Avatar
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    I suppose we don't know the long run. After all, Christians didn't say "it's over" when Muslims controlled Iberia for centuries. But I'm primarily concerned with the present. I also believe that the advent of near-instantaneous international travel and instant global communication have served as accelerants. Maybe history is a lemniscate of decay and instauration. Maybe every society goes through its stages as Spengler said. But you can't deny the West is going through it much more quickly than say, the Roman Empire, did.

    But nevertheless I must say that for the foreseeable future, the math doesn't seem to be there for a Republican to get 270 EC votes. As much as Democrats harp about the EC, it's easier for them to win than for Republicans. Democrats simply have to win the blue states and a couple swing states and presto, 270. Republicans must win the red states, virtually every swing state, and flip states trending blue. Take 2016.

    Trump won 30 states and 306 EC votes. He did so by holding the red states, winning the crucial swing states of Ohio and Florida plus North Carolina and Indiana and Iowa and famously flipping WI, MI, and PA. Now let's remove the latter 3.

    He's at 260, shy of the magic number. In other words, his win was only made possible by flipping WI red for the first time in 32 years and MI and PA for the first time in 28 years.

    That was a fluke and I doubt it happens again. So the ceiling for a Republican is 260 EC votes, really 249 since 260 counts Arizona which is now effectively blue. So a Republican must pick up 21 EC votes from some of the other 17 states Clinton won. Yeah, none of those states are going red again.

    Unless some dark horse comes bursting from the shadows it is a bleak political future indeed.
    Don't ask questions, just consume product and then get excited for next products.

    "They will hurt you. They will hurt your grandma, these people. The root cause of this is there's no discipline in the homes, they don't go to school, you know, they live off the government, no personal accountability, and they just beat people up for no reason, and it's disgusting." - Former Hamilton County Prosecutor Joe Deters

  5. #85
    Senior Member Frequent Poster Steven AB's Avatar
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    The historical examples showing that nothing is written in advance are too many to be listed.

    Anyway, future is not something we should predict or undergo, but do.

    "What doesn't kill me makes me stronger." — Friedrich Nietzsche

    But let’s us assume for a moment that we should merely try to predict the most likely future:

    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
    The SCOTUS majority will age and die, and as soon as Democrats get a majority on SCOTUS it will be ruled unconstitutional. I'm sorry but no Republican is going to win at this point again.
    Even people who are Democrats or death penalty opponents, or both, know that they cannot be that optimistic. In a two-party system the parties naturally make the adjustments for alternance to power. It will always be very hard to win more than two consecutive terms at the White House, and almost impossible to win more than three, as it has been for more than a century. Any claim to contrary is just like the 2015-2016 claims that Trump could never win.

    The experience of their friends Scalia and Ginsburg dying during an adverse Presidency, will likely cause Thomas, Alito and others to resign at the right time to avoid this happening, as Kennedy and others did. Only two of Thomas, Roberts or Alito doing that would be enough for the next three decades.

    Thus to the contrary, it is death penalty opponents who are praying for a "dark horse"-like miracle.

    (Secondarily, any miracle can be followed by another miracle for the other side.

    The sole hope of opponents to have an irreversible death penalty abolishment, was not only to have it through an U.S. Supreme Court ukase, but to have it later accepted as a precedent by conservative Justices.

    But there is now a consensus among Republicans that the Constitution must be construed as Scalia said it should: the originalist doctrine, under which the death penalty will always be constitutional, and subject to no significant restriction.

    That, assuming that judicial review itself could survive a liberal Scotus majority, which is doubtful.

    http://www.cncpunishment.com/forums/...l=1#post137327)

    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
    Capitulation earns nothing. Abolition is already inevitable
    Claiming that abolition is already inevitable is capitulating. It is a basic of culture wars that Saying is Doing. That’s why on this very forum we have unavowed anti-death penalty commenters. That’s also the job for which the oligarchic European Union remunerates Richard Dieter.
    "If ever there were a case for a referendum, this is one on which the people should be allowed to express their own views and not irresponsible votes in the House of Commons." — Winston Churchill, on the death penalty

    The self-styled "Death Penalty Information Center" is financed by the oligarchic European Union. — The Daily Signal

  6. #86
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    NYC bike path terror attack: Sayfullo Saipov gets 10 life sentences plus 260 years

    Sayfullo Saipov listened to victims' testimonies before his sentencing for the ISIS-inspired terrorist attack

    By Marta Dhanis and Andrea Vacchiano
    Fox News

    Sayfullo Saipov, the terrorist who killed eight people by driving a truck into a bike path in New York City six years ago, was sentenced to life in prison Wednesday.

    Saipov, an Islamic extremist, was convicted of all 28 counts brought against him in January, including murder in aid of racketeering and providing material support to the Islamic State of Iraq and al-Sham in January. The October 31, 2017, incident also injured over a dozen people, with prosecutors describing the event as the worst terrorist attack since 9/11.

    U.S. District Judge Vernon Broderick disclosed that he would follow the sentencing guidelines, which were 10 life sentences and 260 years in prison.

    Back in March, the jury failed to reach a unanimous decision to give Saipov the death penalty. The jury had deliberated for 9 hours before reaching their verdict.

    Saipov is expected to serve his sentence at United States Penitentiary, Administrative Maximum Facility in Florence, Colorado. Victims and their family members gave powerful testimonies to the court on Wednesday.

    Belgian native Marion Van Reeth had two of her legs amputated because of injuries she incurred from the attack. Reeth addressed Saipov from her wheelchair.

    "Mr. Saipov, I'm one of your victims, amputated on both legs. I will never be able to walk like you can," Reeth said before breaking down in tears.

    In an emotional testimony, the widow of victim Ariel Erlij told the judge that when she dies and reunites with her husband, she would tell him about how much shame she had in the American justice system.

    "Saipov, your God thinks you’re a coward because you didn’t kill yourself when you killed them," Gabriela Pereya said to the convict. "And if you want to make him accept you and love you, go kill yourself."

    Survivor Rachel Pharn told Saipov that his actions "did not serve Allah."

    "You say you don’t regret. You say it was on purpose. Is that true? I want to know why... how I can fix you, so I can figure out how to fix the world," Pharn said, adding that Allah still loved him despite his sins.

    "Despite all that has been said and done… despite how you distorted his name, he still loves you, and shows you mercy. He has rewarded you with the greatest gift of all, life," she added.

    When he was allowed to speak, Saipov talked about religion for almost an hour, sticking his hand and finger in the air as he preached until the government interrupted. The judge allowed Saipov to speak but admonished him for taking up so much time.

    "I think you need to make your points," Broderick told him.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.fox...-260-years.amp

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